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What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

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  • What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

    I would like to know what the opinions are from the people close to the 9/11 terrorist attacks. I live fairly close by and I'm quite uncomfortable that the administration sees fit to bring these terrorists here, inconvenience us again, exhaust our budget with security costs and put us in a vulnerable position again. I feel it is just drama on the part of the federal government and I'm not very comfortable with it.
    10
    Yes, it's fine, they will protect us.
    70.00%
    7
    No way, Jose, NIMBY!
    30.00%
    3

    The poll is expired.

    roby2000

  • #2
    Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

    I remember the whole 9/11 thing, the uncertainty, seeing a tank go down 7th avenue, the nights when the smell from ground zero brought everyone down to the lobby of my building thinking something was on fire. I feel bringing the trial here somehow is an approariate way to bring closure, as much as something like that is possible with this horrible chapter in our history. We should treat these people like any other criminals and try them near the scene of the crime. New Yorkers are capable of being fair and they've already asked for the death penalty so they can be viewed as martyrs, so moving the venue makes no difference whatsoever. I fear moving the trials sends a message that we are afraid of them. We should not be. They are cowards and crazy. I have faith in our security and our people to make this something the world can see and say New York, and America will not be brought down by the mad terrorists. With dignity and pride we will represent and the world will continue to see why there's no better place in the world to live.

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    • #3
      Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

      As much as I can appreciate the fears, apprehension & bad memories that this decision may have aroused, I ask you this: Where would you suggest the trials be held?

      Now I know this will lead to the inevitable debate as to whether there should even be a trial (as opposed to a tribunal at Gitmo), but I fully stand by the notion that this is a country of laws & those laws apply whether they are "convenient" or not.

      Have you heard Guliani recently?:
      "Giuliani, on a conference call organized by the Republican National Committee called the move ?unnecessary,? because military tribunals are available as an alternative, it would be too much of a burden on New York City, the process would be ?long? and ?drawn out? and a trial would inflict pain on families of those affected by 9/11."

      Compare that to this: "RUDY GIULIANI, FMR. NEW YORK MAYOR: I testified in the penalty phase of the trial. And it was much more difficult than I thought it would be, reviewing all that, going over it, seeing the films of it.

      And, you know, obviously I?m personally involved in this, but I would have preferred a different verdict. But it does show that we have a legal system, that we follow it, that we respect it. And it is exactly what is missing in the parts of the world or a lot of the parts of the world that are breeding terrorism.

      So maybe there is something good that can come out of this in showing these people that?at least showing the ones that have any kind of an open mind that we are a free society, a lawful society, a decent society, that we have respect for people?s rights and that we can have disagreements about whether the death penalty should be imposed on somebody like Moussaoui. " )- May 4, 2006


      Yes, the WTC was located here. No, tribunals are not the same. A "burden", "lon" and "drawn out"? I thought we were talking about administrating justice & yes justice...true justice is a burden, but only someone like Guliani would find that an inconvenience. And finally, yes it most likely will be painful to the families, but trials always are. Some may even find some closure. Would having the trial somewhere else be any less painful? Don't you think some of those family members will go wherever it is held?

      These are not relevant to the issue.

      To quote Guliani from 2006: "So maybe there is something good that can come out of this in showing these people that?at least showing the ones that have any kind of an open mind that we are a free society, a lawful society, a decent society, that we have respect for people?s rights..."

      I hate to admit it, but I agree with that 100%.

      CD
      NYC
      Need computer assistance?
      See my Classified/Computer maintenance listing or send me a private message.

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      • #4
        Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

        Thanks for the thoughtful and pragmatic responses to the question. I'm glad that, so far, no one got personal and there was a lot of thought in the responses.

        You know, the most frustrating part of this whole episode is that the opinins on both sides are valid. We need to prove that our constitution will stand and will dole out the right punishment. But, of course, many of us who were "locked down" for 3 weeks after 9/11 will not be comfortable. The only thing I will hope for at this juncture is the swift completion and proper sentencing, death or not, will be done. It evidently is going to happen, so we'll just take an extra Valium and put up with whatever inconveniences will will need to endure. Hopefully, the affect on daily life will be minor.

        Hearing from the other side of the issue has explained a lot and eased some of my apprehensions.
        roby2000

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        • #5
          Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

          I think this video belongs in this debate. Nobody can say it better IMHO.

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qtjfMjjce2Y

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          • #6
            Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

            Well, I could almost agree with newt, but, seeing what a hipocrite he was, spouting family values while leaving his wife on her deathbed and fiddling around with his chippie, I take everything this phoney says with a grain of salt. The remark about having "under god" in the pledge is rediculous. It was never in there until Eisenhower crumbled from Catholic Church pressure to allow it in. I really don't like this man or his policies.
            roby2000

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            • #7
              Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

              Originally posted by JoJe View Post
              I think this video belongs in this debate. Nobody can say it better IMHO.

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qtjfMjjce2Y
              I'm afraid that you will have to state what it is you agree with as I was unable to watch the video beyond the first minute or so.

              I have not got one second of my life to waste listening to the drivel this guy spouts. He starts with his "2+2=4" game & then leaves out any mention of the predatory lending practices that were used to mislead people into thinking they could afford "the American Dream" of home ownership. This was a message that was repeated often by Republicans to bolster their argument that people that were "vested" in a society would be better "citizens".

              I personally witness the anguish that a co-worker went through when she was considering buying her first home. I knew exactly how little she made & I knew that her husband was the manager of a pizza parlor down in the Financial district (only did lunch business). I mention this not to diminish their hard work nor to imply that they were not good people, but to show that they were not well positioned, financially to buy a house. They had been witness to the housing fever & felt they were being left behind. Their extended family consisted of her mother, who had a part-time job, their grammar school aged daughter & her sister who had an infant child but no husband that needed daycare, even though the sister had no job.

              They found a house that had 2 apartments that they thought they could rent & the owner, who had rebuilt the house helped them find financing WITH NO MONEY DOWN.

              I'm no financial genius, but I am old enough to remember when people would say that they needed to "save" to accumulate a large enough Down payment so the monthly mortgage would be manageable.

              On a number of occasions my co-worker would ask my advice about how to find renters for her apartment & there was 1 occasion when the financiers were calling 2-3 times a day to pressure her into getting all of her papers in order to sign. It turned out they wanted her mother WHO ONLY WORKED PART_TIME to co-sign.

              Once renters were coming by to see the apartment, her sister announced that she wanted to move into one of the apartments & they saw that their living space was too small for her mother to be there too.

              When we parted company she had her sister who would disappear for days occupying one apartment, her mother who worked part time & was paying for day-care for her practically abandoned grandchild in the other & after the first big rain, the pavement, which was defective flooded the basement & destroyed the boiler.

              I felt compelled once or twice to suggest that maybe the timing was not right for the purchase. These suggestions were met with hostility & accusations of racism. Obviously I backed off & watched as this poor woman was railroaded by a disreputable owner & aggressive lenders, all of whom were from the Latino community & therefore were afforded a greater degree of trust than should have been afforded.


              Now back to Mr. Gingrich:
              He starts with a story about how people who "can't afford" a house should not buy one and for the last 25 years the Government's "official policy" says "we won't look at your credit rating", "no down payment", "below market interest rate", etc. And that this was "living a lie".

              He fails to mention that none of those things were possible if finance regulations had not been gutted in the name of a free market being able to "regulate itself". This is a truly feeble attempt to politicize what is essentially an issue of greed on the part of a housing finance sector run amok.

              He is a fraud & a liar. Period.

              He then goes on to suggest "impeachment" because he disagrees with this administration.

              Ignore. Fail. Whatever you want to call it. That was all I could stand. He waves the flag without recognizing that this is a country of laws & the BIG LAW says that majority rules until after the next election.

              Nothing...I repeat nothing that he has to say is worth me listening to. He is predictably self-serving passe hack.

              This country needs to be strengthened by resolve, not weakened by fear.

              Since you feel that there is something in that trough of swill worth discussing, do feel free to present it, I couldn't stand the stink.

              CD
              NYC
              Need computer assistance?
              See my Classified/Computer maintenance listing or send me a private message.

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              • #8
                Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

                I'm not saying that I agree or disagree with what you wrote, but what does it have to do with whether or not the trials should be held in New York?

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                • #9
                  Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

                  Snap,
                  Should I assume that you are addressing that question to me?
                  If so, can I ask if you watched the Gingrich video that was linked by JoJe?

                  I have to admit that I simply could not. When it got to the part where he was not only questioning whether or not these guys should be given a trial at all, because it's a post 9/11 (trademark Rudy G.) world, blah, blah. He started spouting nonsense about impeachment because he disagreed with the Atty. Gen'l. going forward with the prosecution as prescribed by law.

                  I will not watch any more. So if Joje wants to enter that into the discussion I was requesting that he do so by making some point or other.

                  This would bring us to the crux of the matter: whether or not they should be tried at all & if not what is their status & how should they be dealt with?

                  I reiterate my point: "This country needs to be strengthened by resolve, not weakened by fear."

                  Terrorism is not a state on which one can declare war (just like drugs), it is a tactic whereby thugs carry out violent acts on an unarmed public to draw attention to their cause &/or try to extract a change in behavior. These acts of violence are criminal in nature & those that commit them, conspire with, or abet others that do, should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

                  Should these thugs be tried here in New York? Why not? Who has more skin in this game than we New Yorkers? Should it be in Washington? If you ask me they'd make a mess of it & besides if anything were to happen, should it be near our center of government? Where did Atta & his minions focus their attention? Two planes to the WTC & only 1 other to DC. They were not after the government, they were after the culture & NYC is the cultural center as far as the world is concerned, so why should we not take care of our own?

                  Remember that old overused phrase that has no become a joke: "If so-&-so happens, then the terrorists win". Well Rudy & Newt & all the other fear mongers want you to believe that "the terrorist have won" by saying over & over that we are now somehow different. Don't we still believe in the basic tenants of our society? Have we really changed that much? Even before 9/11 weren't we here in New York always 'looking out'?

                  What has Gingrich got to do with the question about the trial? Ask JoJe. I just want to be sure that whatever Newt said, we should consider his motivations.

                  Personally, I'm more interested in what my fellow New Yorkers have to say.

                  CD
                  NYC
                  Need computer assistance?
                  See my Classified/Computer maintenance listing or send me a private message.

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                  • #10
                    Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

                    Don't we still believe in the basic tenants of our society? Have we really changed that much? Even before 9/11 weren't we here in New York always 'looking out'?
                    A typo, no doubt (tenants=tenets), but it gives me a wonderful opportunity to say NO, we do not believe in the basic tenants of our society -- who are paying such exorbitant rents that many are going homeless and young families simply cannot afford a roof over their heads anymore. This should probably have its own subject in another section on the board, but I couldn't resist the temptation here because it has such ramifications on our entire society.

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                    • #11
                      Re: What do you think of holding the terror trials in NYC?

                      Thanks for the correction. I neglected to check my spell checker.

                      You are also correct in saying that the rent issue deserves it's own thread.

                      CD
                      Need computer assistance?
                      See my Classified/Computer maintenance listing or send me a private message.

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